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Uneven Lies Ryder Cup is ON!

• Corwyn 2,410 Posts

  Wed, Jan 8 2014 10:43 PM

  

  Team ROW      16    :    8    Team USA

  The first-ever UEL Ryder Cup is over and won by team ROW! Thank you to all players who participated and helped make this such a great event!

  ------------------------

  Final Tournament Standings: after Worst-Ball, Best-Ball, and Singles Series ...

  Overall Series Score: Team ROW: 16  |  Team USA: 8

  

  Congratulations to the ROW team! (and here is WigerToods' specially-engraved trophy!)

  

   

  please find information about the tourney below (kept for future reference)

  --------------------

  The first-ever Uneven Lies Ryder Cup is here!

  For this first-edition, I decided in the end to make it self-selection rather than have any qualifying. (The full preliminary post is copied below for reference).

  In the future, we might have a qualifying process based on weekly singles UEL tourneys, assuming they continue as a regular feature.

  This time, we got enthusiastic signups from 14 US players and 15 ROW players, and have teams of 12 based on sign-up order. (Note 3 ROW players had scheduling difficulties)

  The tournament is now concluded, with a 16-8 win for the ROW team.

  --------------------------------------------------------------

  Here are important links:

  Time Availability Sheet (see process in next post below) [sign-up form]

  Specific Matches for 1st Week Worst-Ball Series (spreadsheet link | forum post link with explanation and expectations)

  Specific Matches for 2nd Week Best-Ball Series (spreadsheet link | forum post link with explanation and expectations)

  Specific Matches for 3rd Week Singles Series (spreadsheet link | forum post link with explanation and expectations)

  Screenshot posting requirements explained here (scorecard, and stats if you can, please!)

  Guidelines in the event of interrupted matches, disconnects, no-shows, etc.

  Results Sheet

  --------------------------------------------------------------

  Scheduling & Team Co-Captains

  ROW :: Corwyn & SteveReilly

  USA :: ColumbusStorm & Dougsda

  Captains have been helping to select team pairings for the four-player series' and provide the blind 'secret envelope' line-up lists for their teams.

  That said, scheduling for this tourney is highly dependent on availability rather than strategy or chance! We are running it based on players' declared playing times and matching people up accordingly.

  What to do next?

  Send Friend Requests to your playing partner and your opponents from the other team. Either use this forum thread to confirm your matches via public replies (please quote this post and any relevant replies to make it easier to track), or do it all via PMs. [Note though that many people are having trouble with PMs recently, so follow up to make sure messages received, and always post here in the thread so we know you are scheduled.]

  This tourney will not work if you rely on just 'catching your partner and opponents green' -- you must schedule a specific time and date, and be there at that time!

  --------------------------------------------------------------

  FORMAT & ROUND CONDITIONS:

  At this time, there is no way to play Foursomes (Alt Shot) with uneven lies. With this constraint, we are instead playing the first set of six 9-hole team matches as four ball 'Worst-Ball' whereby the worst score of a 2-player team would count as their team's score for that hole, and the hole will be won by the team with the lowest Worst-Ball score. Players will keep track of the Matchplay score as they go via the chat.

  Also, please note, Gimme's are NOT allowed. You must put the ball in the hole!  If anyone does take a Gimme, it'll count as a 10 on your card, so... Don't take a Gimme!

  The ROW team (as reigning Virtual Ryder Cup champions) have the honor, and so should set up the matches and be the first pair to tee off.

  Please designate one player per match (per team as backup) to capture and share scorecard screenshots in the forum thread. Note that there can be an A/S result, which will mean 1/2 point to each team.

  ----------------------

  Week 1 (from Tue 1/28 to Mon 2/3) :: Worst-Ball series :: Match Conditions:  

  Merion :: 4-Player Strokeplay :: Practice Mode :: Front 9 :: Easy Pins :: Orange (Hard) tees :: Tournament Green speed :: High wind :: Uneven Lies :: 90 second timer

   

  Here is our line-up for the 1st week 4-Player Worst-Ball Matches, to be completed by Mon 3rd Feb:  see Chart here

  ROW Team                  vs                    USA

  A ::      jsweetcr & LOLserver                      KyRock75 & iconian

  B ::      Daskino & Priestess                         deedles77 & woodoworkery

  C ::      Corwyn & Dazza501                       natemakesaholein & devonnnnn

  D ::      stevereilly & WigerToods2010      Cygnus3000 &  moosetaya    

  E ::      oneeyedjohn & Bonalyau               ColumbusStorm & jimbech

  F ::       johehejo & FairwayRuepel68       wesdogg75 & bhoese

  ----------------------

  Week 2  (from now to Mon 2/10):: will be Best-Ball fourball with a set of six matches to be played over 9 holes (the back 9 this time at Merion) with the following conditions:

  Merion :: 4-Player Strokeplay :: Practice Mode :: Back 9 :: Hard Pins :: Champion (Hardest) tees :: Tournament Green speed :: Moderate wind :: Uneven Lies :: 90 second timer

  Matches to be completed by Mon 10th Feb (you can start as soon as it works for all your players):  see Chart here

  A ::        oneeyedjohn & Bonalyau               Cygnus3000 & jimbech 

  B ::        Daskino & Corwyn                           devonnnnn & deedles77

  C ::        stevereilly & WigerToods2010      ColumbusStorm & bhoese

  D ::        johehejo & FairwayRuepel68        woodoworkery & natemakesaholein

  E ::        jsweetcr & fmagnets                         KyRock75 & iconian

  F ::        Dazza501 & LOLserver                   wesdogg75 & dakotarov

  ----------------------

   … and finally Week 3  (from Mon 2/10 to Mon 2/17) :: will be 12 singles matches, played over all 18 holes at Merion with the following conditions:

  Merion :: 2-player Matchplay :: Practice Mode :: Full 18 holes :: Medium Pins :: Champion (Hardest) tees :: Tournament Green speed :: High wind :: Uneven Lies :: 90 second timer

  Please note: Matches should end at the 18th, if they haven't ended earlier. You should not play Extra Holes. If match is tied after 18, then the result is A/S.

  Here is our line-up for the 3rd week Singles Matches, to be completed by Mon 17th Feb (you can start anytime from this Monday on):  see Chart here

                ROW Team           vs          USA

  A ::        fmagnets                               Cygnus3000

  B ::       Dazza501                              devonnnnn

  C ::       Bonalyau                               TarheelsRule

  D ::        LOLserver                            wesdogg75

  E ::        FairwayRuepel68               KyRock75

  F ::        stevereilly                              iconian

  G ::        Corwyn                                 jimbech

  H ::        WigerToods2010               deedles77

  I ::          oneeyedjohn                      ColumbusStorm

  J ::         jsweetcr                               bhoese

  K ::        johehejo                               woodoworkery

  L ::        Daskino                                Dakotarov

  FYI: Nate has been 'excused' from the rest of the competition and is replaced by next alternate TarheelsRule for the singles.

  Note too that we will also have the following two tie-breaker matches.These will be matches 'for fun' to make sure those players get some involvement even if not called upon earlier in the tournament. However, should the rest of the Ryder Cup end up in a tie, the results of these matches will be the tie-breaker for the competition! [Edit: just to add, this arrangement takes us through all the ROW alternates, which is why there is no 15th match to involve the last US alternate, but it does ensure that every player in both team pools will have had a game in the competition]

  Those matches are:

                ROW Team           vs          USA

  1 ::        Priestess                              Moosetaya

  2 ::        Alcaucin                               FlaTexBoy

  --------------------------------------------------------------

  Prizes and Sponsors

  I've been so busy with scheduling, I haven't put any thought into prizes yet, but if anyone is so minded to offer donations we will certainly put them to good use!

  There could be prizes for most points from each team, player of the tournament, or other suggestions.

  Any players who want to help by live-streaming matches in the Singles series would be very welcome. Please PM me or post here in the thread.

  Thanks and good luck to all participants!

  Corwyn

  ------------------

  Edit: 1/30 4am: amendment to Gimme ruling. Anyone taking a gimme will have 10 count as their score on that hole, since the ball never went in the hole!

  Edit: 2/2: week 2 Best-Ball matches posted

  Edit: 2/8: week 3 Singles matches posted

  Edit: 2/9: added note about no extra holes for singles matches

  Edit: 2/20: final result, and trophy, posted!

• Corwyn 2,410 Posts

  Wed, Jan 8 2014 10:44 PM

  TIME AVAILABILITY FORM is now available.

  Participating players, please fill out your availability via the form at this link.

  Please fill out this form to let us know your Time Zone and your LOCAL time availability, along with preferred days to play. and I'll figure out an availability grid to help make viable pairings for the tourney.

  Captains and myself will use this information to pair you with and against players who really can play at those times, so that we can have a tourney that runs smoothly, without suffering endless delays in trying to connect people. We are dealing with 4-player games for the first 2 series of Worst-Ball and Best-Ball, so getting the Availability Data right at the start is crucial to the tourney working successfully. 

  Please provide times you can definitely play (you'll get a few days notice for each precisely scheduled game) for the weeks Jan 27-Feb2, Feb 3-9, and Feb 10-16. 

   

  My hope is that we can get through each series in one week! Matches will get firmly scheduled (there will be no reliance on "seeing someone green"!), and we will expect players to keep to commitments (obviously allowing for real-life interference if that happens). Is this ambitious, oh yes!!! Is it doable, most definitely YES... with your help!!!

  Why is it so complicated?

  The idea behind filling out the detailed entry form with all the hourly radio buttons to click is that we get an accurate picture of when everyone can play, and then we are paired together with teammates, and against opponents, whose times really do overlap. Yes, it feels like a lot of work to get through the form initially, but trust me, it speeds everything up in the long run, and gives us the best chance of arranging 4-player matches that can actually work.

  Once everyone's data is in, we'll be looking for 2-3 hour blocks where people overlap. I'm anticipating matches should last no more than 1.5-2hrs+ for 4 players with 90 second timer for a 9-hole match, and something similar for the singles, 2 players over 18 holes.

  Here's an example of how it will work once I've organized your responses: right-click to enlarge to enlarge this sample pic

  

  The time boxes you clicked on in the entry form will be conditionally formatted to show in Green for your YES's, and in Yellow for Possible times you can play. (Red is NO, not available). Based on the time zone you gave, everyone's grid has been adjusted to UTC time, which are the times in the column headings... However, in the Green boxes, I've retained a note of the time, in your local time, to make it easier for you to tell when it actually is!

  So, in this example, deedles and I have an availability overlap weekdays from 4-7pm UTC (deedles' 12-3pm on the East Coast of the U.S., and my 9am-noon in California).

  -----------------------

  If you've been through this exercise for one of our UEL tournaments before, you'll know that it really works... and I can save you clicking through those radio buttons again. Just check what you submitted last time at one of the following links, and put a note in the Availability Form 'exceptions' field to ask that I use your info from that specific tourney.

  You can also post to the same effect in the forum thread. And feel free to let me know of minor amendments in that way too, e.g. "Same times as Tough-It-Out III, but now can't play Saturdays".

  Prior Availability Charts:

  Tough-It-Out III  |  Shiner's UEL Tourney @ Merion  |  Tough-It-Out II 

   

  --------

  Please check this post for updates once the Availability Chart is ready. Thanks!

• Corwyn 2,410 Posts

  Wed, Jan 8 2014 10:44 PM

  <I've moved the original first post in this thread down to here for reference. Please note it was preliminary and speculative. Things have changed since then! Final details on how the tourney is operating are in the 1st post above>

  ---------------------------------------------------------

  This is a preliminary post to establish interest levels in this possible tournament.

  There has been an almost-annual Ryder Cup, held here on WGT, between US and ROW teams and involving many of the top players in the game. The last one took place in late 2012 after Olympic became available.

  One thing I was struck by in watching many of the games, which were so generously streamed by 3rd-party players, was that matches tended to be decided based on which player failed to birdie particular holes. The standard of play is so high amongst the top players that that was almost inevitable. Well, now that Uneven Lies has become more widely accepted by the playing community, and so many top players have risen to the additional challenge that it offers, it seems time to offer a Ryder Cup with these tougher conditions, in the hope that a fuller range of matchplay skills (and strategy) might come into play.

  In making this initial post, I'm looking for the following:

  1. Provisional signups from anyone interested in participating (please note which team you'd hope to represent). If there is interest, I'll create a fuller signup form in a week or two, once it's clearer how the selection process might work.

  2. Offers of possible support in organizing the event. For instance, I'm seeking volunteer non-playing captains to make wildcard picks, choose player pairings, and to work collaboratively with myself and a neutral 'scheduler' to assign matches that will work based on players' availability. Please note: participation will depend on filling out in due course a Time Availability form to result in a spreadsheet that will show match arrangers whose playing times overlap. My goal is to avoid drawn-out scheduling issues. I've used this system in organizing Tough-It-Out events and it seems to work well.

  3. Comments on the fairest way to select the 12 players (and several alternates) for each team, should there be more demand than places available!

  Previous Ryder Cups have had a lengthy qualification process based on WGT's weekly single-play tournaments. Until now, that's not been an option for uneven lies. However, just before Christmas, WGT introduced a weekly single-play UEL that ran 4 weeks (incorporating Cabo, Whistler, Olympic, RSG), and after an absence for a couple of days, is continuing this week with Kiawah. I'm hoping that WGT's plan is to offer a full course rotation in this series.

  One option might be to have a qualification process based on points accumulated for the best 6 finishes (out of what I hope will be 10) in these weekly UEL single-play events. That way, anyone who has already participated in the first 4 (and thus demonstrated commitment to UEL) could count their best finishes alongside those in the remaining qualification events.

  A challenge with this method will be how to compare standings across tiers. As a good friend pointed out, a top 3 finish in a Legend event is not the same as one in TL… but a 20th in Legend (top 10%) is perhaps better than the equivalent in TL (bottom half of the field). I guess one approach could be just to tally best overall score related to par, and mix TLs and Ls in the same ranking.

  --------------------------------

  Venue: At this point, I'm thinking the event should be played at Merion, as our newest course, and which has not yet hosted a WGT Ryder Cup. (But it's not the hardest uneven lie course, lol… so I'm a little torn!)

  Format: At this time, there is no way to play Foursomes (Alt Shot) with uneven lies. With this constraint, I'm considering an unusual choice for one set of six 9-hole team matches: 'Worst-Ball' whereby the worst score of a 2-player team would count as their team's score for that hole.

  There would also be the traditional set of six matches of Four-Ball (Better-Ball), to be played over 9 holes (the other 9) … and 12 singles matches, played over 18 holes.

  Timeframe: if the above qualification period is needed, then we're looking at the tournament taking place late February, beginning of March, 2014. My hope is for as condensed an event as possible.

  Later on, again assuming there is interest in this event, I will ask for offers to livestream singles matches, and outline possible special awards, and ask for any offers of sponsorship.

  Please note, this tournament will be a 'fancy-clubs' uneven lies event. I may well host a starter-clubs only version in the future.

  Thanks for reading. I look forward to hearing feedback and any expressions of interest, 

  Corwyn

• Daskino 2,781 Posts

  Thu, Jan 9 2014 3:50 AM

  Hi Corwyn,

  as a ROW Team member in 2011 & 2012 WGT Ryder Cup, I'd be delighted to run for another Ryder challenge. And uneven lies final event in Merion - last 5 holes are something brutal :) - and for the qualification process would be a great idea.

  Unfortunately we can't play UEL foursome matches atm - and it doesn't look WGT is willing to release an alternate practice game mode; just four balls (in Multiplay practice stroke play) and match play (practice mode). Anyway, I don't think the whole format would be ruined by a Even Alternate session + UEL Best Ball / Matchplay.

  Just a word on the qualification process: I think would be fair to run 8 UEL events, with no chance to drop any score. Best nine + two/three captain's picks would be part of the Teams. I'm not sure tho on Legends/TL comparison standings; just remember there might not be same tournament conditions.

  Luciano

• Corwyn 2,410 Posts

  Thu, Jan 9 2014 5:34 AM

  Hi Luciano,

  So glad to hear you'd be interested!

  Corwyn:

  Format: At this time, there is no way to play Foursomes (Alt Shot) with uneven lies. With this constraint, I'm considering an unusual choice for one set of 8 9-hole team matches: 'Worst-Ball' whereby the worst score of a 2-player team would count as their team's score for that hole.

  Yes, buried in the opening post was the awareness that we can't do UEL Foursomes. I did ask Icon about it, and I think you all know the answer to that.... ;)

  But, what do you think about the 'Worst-Ball' idea as an alternative? I'd rather keep the whole event as UEL (since that's the point), and just have a new format in the mix. I think it would keep players on their toes, especially at Merion, where disaster can strike easily.

  I agree that a qualification with no chance to drop a score would be best. It's just that the weekly UEL singles have already started, so I wanted to suggest an option that rewarded those who had shown some commitment to the format already. One other suggestion I've received is to ask Shoe/Icon to set up a tierless qualifier (for instance, over 4-6 rounds, 3 days apart). 

  What have the TL tourney conditions been for the weekly UEL singles? For Legend, they've consistently been Low wind, Tourney greens from the tips (except for this week's Kiawah with Mod winds). Obviously the TLs will be getting Champ greens but otherwise I'm guessing the conditions will be similar.

  Cheers, Corwyn

• Daskino 2,781 Posts

  Thu, Jan 9 2014 7:45 AM

  Corwyn:

  Yes, buried in the opening post was the awareness that we can't do UEL Foursomes. I did ask Icon about it, and I think you all know the answer to that.... ;)

  Yeah, I guess so. Anyway, it's too bad; I don't think an alternate practice game mode should be so tough to develop.

  Corwyn:

  But, what do you think about the 'Worst-Ball' idea as an alternative? I'd rather keep the whole event as UEL (since that's the point), and just have a new format in the mix. I think it would keep players on their toes, especially at Merion, where disaster can strike easily.

  I agree the point is to have a full UEL Ryder. I just have to think over "Worst Ball" idea. :)

  Corwyn:

  One other suggestion I've received is to ask Shoe/Icon to set up a tierless qualifier (for instance, over 4-6 rounds, 3 days apart).

  A Qualifying School. Smart suggestion.

  Corwyn:

  What have the TL tourney conditions been for the weekly UEL singles? For Legend, they've consistently been Low wind, Tourney greens from the tips (except for this week's Kiawah with Mod winds). Obviously the TLs will be getting Champ greens but otherwise I'm guessing the conditions will be similar.

  Quite correct. This week conditions are Low - Championship.

• Wesdogg75 2,431 Posts

  Thu, Jan 9 2014 1:21 PM

  Corwyn, since your last uneven lie starter club tournament I have been waiting for another so I would be thrilled to give it a go should this thing happen!!

  Wes

• GLADSTONESCREWER 749 Posts

  Thu, Jan 9 2014 1:30 PM

  Uneaven Lies Great Idea,

  I would try to make Team ROW as long as its not Starter ***

• natemakesaholein 105 Posts

  Fri, Jan 10 2014 10:44 AM

  can I join? if so, I am in

• Corwyn 2,410 Posts

  Fri, Jan 10 2014 12:05 PM

  Yes, great to have all of you express your interest. Please do also say which team (USA or ROW) you would hope to represent (since flags don't necessarily indicate country of choice).

  If there's enough interest, we'll need to have qualification. Otherwise, it might just be based on whoever signs up... so don't be shy! If you're up for some UEL fun in a Ryder Cup format, sign up here.

  And just to be clear, this is a 'fancy clubs' tourney: play any clubs/balls that you want... not a starters event.