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what is happening?

• gsoup 2,929 Posts

  Mon, Jan 10 2011 3:10 PM

  now now

  stop

  thx

  -G

   

• CharlemagneRH 1,054 Posts

  Mon, Jan 10 2011 3:14 PM

  tiffer67:

  Never heard of Operation Sea Lion then?

  Never happened.

  Operation Barbarossa did, however.  Seven million Soviets soldiers were killed, injured, or captured in Barbarossa alone.  For their efforts, they killed, wounded, or captured almost a million German soldiers and destroyed 2,000 aircraft and almost 3,000 tanks.

  When the dust of WWII settled, 14% of the Soviet Union's population was dead, whereas the UK lost only 1%.

• tiffer67 1,764 Posts

  Mon, Jan 10 2011 3:33 PM

  Charle, Operation Sea Lion never happened because Goering's promise to Hitler to wipe out the RAF inside 6 weeks failed abysmally. Without superiority of the skies a landing of German troops on British soil would have been doomed. Not even Hitler was daft enough to proceed on that basis.

  So your prior statement concerning a German invasion is utter nonsense. As for the stats you quote above, I fail to see what relevance they have to our point of discussion.

• CharlemagneRH 1,054 Posts

  Mon, Jan 10 2011 3:44 PM

  tiffer67:

  Charle, Operation Sea Lion never happened because Goering's promise to Hitler to wipe out the RAF inside 6 weeks failed abysmally. Without superiority of the skies a landing of German troops on British soil would have been doomed. Not even Hitler was daft enough to proceed on that basis.

  So your prior statement concerning a German invasion is utter nonsense. As for the stats you quote above, I fail to see what relevance they have to our point of discussion.

  The effort behind Nazi attempts to invade the UK were dwarfed -- by orders of magnitude -- by the effort they expended attempting to invade the Soviet Union.  Barbarossa was the largest military campaign in history, and if Barbarossa had been aimed at the UK instead of Russia, you'd probably be highly offended right now if a Russian was trying to pretend as though the Russia had suffered just as much and had been the main reason for Germany's defeat.

  The Soviet Union, Poland, etc. took the overwhelming majority of destruction dished out by the Axis powers, and the Soviet Union was the nation that inflicted the highest casualties on the ***.  Even in terms of the war against Japan, the Soviet Union kicked them out of Manchuria, Japan's only source of oil and coal.  The Soviet Union's impact on the outcome of the war dwarfs that of the UK.  Period.

• tiffer67 1,764 Posts

  Mon, Jan 10 2011 3:51 PM

  Charle the Tiger tank was a wonderful tank, only matched by the T-34 in terms of punch. No matter how good it was and admirably assisted it was by Stugs, Panzers, Panthers and Jagdpanthers, it couldn't drive across the English Channel. Operation Barbarossa could not have been launched against the UK and an invasion didn't happen because of that.

  I have not mentioned the suffering of the British nation, nor have I dismissed the greater suffering of the Russian nation. I have simply pointed out to you that your previous statement was nonsense. I am sorry if it is proving difficult for you to realise this.

• CharlemagneRH 1,054 Posts

  Mon, Jan 10 2011 4:07 PM

  tiffer67:

  I have not mentioned the suffering of the British nation, nor have I dismissed the greater suffering of the Russian nation. I have simply pointed out to you that your previous statement was nonsense. I am sorry if it is proving difficult for you to realise this.

  There are, of course, some other minor reasons why the UK was not invaded (for example, American aid, which started flowing much sooner than is officially admitted, is another,) but none of them are because the BOB was not entirely successful.  BOB was only a failure in the sense that the aerial battle did not cause the UK to surrender and did not completely destroy the RAF.  The RAF did not "win," however.  Losses were pretty even on both sides.

  The magnitude of BOB was dwarfed by Barbarossa.  BOB was to Barbarossa what a paper cut is to a severed limb.  Comparing the UK's contribution to the defeat of the *** to the contribution made by the Soviets is scandalous.  The UK had about as much to do with the defeat of the *** as a cheerleader has to do with a football team winning.

  Had Hitler put as much effort and resources into invading the UK as he did the Soviet Union, it would have happened.  Period.  The BOB wouldn't have stopped that.  The UK wasn't invaded primarily because Hitler focused the majority of his resources on the Soviet Union, which he absolutely hated.

• craigswan 31,006 Posts

  Mon, Jan 10 2011 11:04 PM

  And you guys saw the japanese sailing up the pacific .

• tiffer67 1,764 Posts

  Mon, Jan 10 2011 11:57 PM

  How stupid of me to forget that Charle knows everything about everything and if he doesn't he just makes it up to suit, lol......

• JuanMendoza 469 Posts

  Tue, Jan 11 2011 12:13 AM

  Agree with all but the last bit Charlie, even if air superiority had been won, and the Brits had left all their heavy weapons at Dunkirk, there was some question as to whether the Boxies had enough naval power to support an opposed sea invasion, nowhere near enough transports and they would have had to been as lucky with the weather as the Allies were on D-day....

• CharlemagneRH 1,054 Posts

  Tue, Jan 11 2011 3:14 AM

  craigswan:

  And you guys saw the japanese sailing up the pacific .

  Before Pearl Harbor?  Of course we did.

  tiffer67:

  How stupid of me to forget that Charle knows everything about everything and if he doesn't he just makes it up to suit, lol......

  I made up the fact that Barbarossa was the biggest military operation in history, and that the BOB was minor by comparison?

  I made up the fact that Hitler allowed over 300,000 British and French soldiers escape back to the UK prior to the BOB, when he could have easily killed or captured them?

  I made up the fact that Hitler spent almost no resources in attempting to invade England?

  I made up the fact that Hitler hated the Communists, whereas he wanted to remain friendly with the UK?

   

  What exactly is it that I made up, tiffer?  This is WWII 101.