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cheating software

Wed, Dec 6 2023 10:32 PM (154 replies)
  • pjctas0822
    4,591 Posts
    Wed, Apr 17 2013 9:17 PM

    tramilleo:

    DEENA     ^^^Here Here I concur 100%^^^,  WGT has never been a company that one would associate the word integrity too,they are robbing us blind with their cheating software,(which they denied for a couple of years mind you).When your dinged shot flies straight right or left and into water, is this not cheating?I am one who used to cry about the meter,in 2009 it was just a hiccup,but as time progressed it became worse,i did not understand it at first,but then it dawned on me that. The Meter Is WGT's Cash Cow, now follow me.If the meter is 100% stable,how many balls do you think you would hit OB, or into water? EXACTLY ZERO,so jerky,unstable meter = lost balls,=$$. Why do i say this?The wgt regular ball has not changed in 3 years not one dot of forgiveness or distance,while they have added over 30 different balls over same time frame. And mind you, all the while ducking and dodging and straight up not answering any question concerning meter, just the old standard IT is your cache,flash,browser,friends list,etc.WHAT A JOKE.i mean there are some children that play your game that will fall for anything you say wgt,but real adults see you for what you are.

    I hear about losing balls in water all the time in this forum. I can count on my hands how many I actually have lost in the water on a meter skip. Thats not many at all. Maybe I dont take enough risky shots when wtaer is near :) .

    Now I am no WGT cheerleader by any means :) but I just dont seem to experience the Meter VEM water shots.

  • MBaggese
    15,367 Posts
    Wed, Apr 17 2013 9:31 PM

    pjctas0822:
    I have used FF for a very long time and have yet to have this occur to me. Not that it matters because I never get invites to play anywho :)

     

    Because you culled your friends list;)

     

     

  • pjctas0822
    4,591 Posts
    Wed, Apr 17 2013 9:49 PM

    MBaggese:

    pjctas0822:
    I have used FF for a very long time and have yet to have this occur to me. Not that it matters because I never get invites to play anywho :)

     

    Because you culled your friends list;)

     

     

    Yeah but even before that didnt make no nevermind :)

  • MBaggese
    15,367 Posts
    Wed, Apr 17 2013 10:17 PM

    pjctas0822:
    Yeah but even before that didnt make no nevermind :)

     

    Uhh...I invited you many times, and w e played a few AS games.

     

    Thing is, if you are not "green"..no one invites you...and most of us just look at our friends list to see who's on and green.

     

    But no worries mate, feel free to invite when ya like...oops...you'd have to go to my profile to see if I'm on. or take a random guess and send an invite...seems lie a lotta work when you consider the alternatives:)

  • MBaggese
    15,367 Posts
    Thu, Apr 18 2013 12:22 AM

    goldeena:

    I have read all the comments on this thread and nobody seems to be seeing it for what it actually is, taking a very basic line of thought on the issue with a few direct questions  this is where I arrived.....

     

    Q: What exactly does this software achieve for the player?

     

    A: Enhanced game play by way of computer aided assistance.

     

    Q: What exactly does high grade equipment (clubs and balls) achieve for the player?

     

    A: Enhanced game play by way of computer aided assistance.

     

    Q: What's the difference?

     

    A: WGT get no financial returns on external software and the user of said software will be using it in secret - i.e the software remains an underground form of computer aided assistance.

     

    Q: What is the definition of 'cheat'

     

    A: cheat  

    /CHēt/
    Verb
    Act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage, esp. in a game or examination: "she cheats at cards".
    Noun
    A person who behaves dishonestly in order to gain an advantage.
    Synonyms
    verb.   deceive - swindle - trick - defraud - fool - bamboozle
    noun.   fraud - swindler - humbug - deceiver - trickster

     

    Q: Is the user of said cheat software a cheater ?

     

    A: Yes, because they are using computer aided assistance secretively and without the other guy knowing it, THIS IS THE ONLY NOTION OF 'CHEAT' FOR WHICH THE USER CAN BE ACCUSED, the user cannot be accused of being a cheat for gaining an unfair performance advantage so much as a competitor who is using G20 clubs cannot be accused of cheating over the other guy using his standard WGT gear.

     

    Q: Will WGT do anything more about it?

     

    A: Very unlikely, they've known about it since its conception, they'd have to take the whole issue to a court (I don't know how laws work in the case of internet issues which are by their nature 'international' and not confined to the ethics book of any particular country), besides it would cost them a lot of money - a lot more money than the cheats are costing them using their own brand of computer aided assistance . One things for sure any talk of 'saving the integrity of the game' will fall on deaf ears as WGT has already proved itself to be a company running a mainly financial gains culture with no obvious signs of running a customer first culture (American business approach as opposed to a Japanese - they just don''t like Denning in the West).

     

    Q: What have WGT done about it in the past?

     

    A: Introduced anti-cheat 'cheat' software such as VEM, wind gusting and uneven lies. Whichever way you think about it VEM et. al. CAN ONLY BE CONSIDERED AS COMPUTER AIDED OBSTRUCTION to the player, the opposite of both computer assisted forms highlighted above, and they may be considered as OBSTRUCTION CHEATING software if they remain hidden to the players knowledge - such as may be the case with wind gusting.

     

    Conclusion?

    Draw your own conclusions but do refrain from crying the devil over people using other covert forms of assistance - they can only help so much as max balls can slow a meter and help you ding it - the true knowledge must be sought by honest strife on the players part and no software will ever be able to take that in to its domain, WGT have shown themselves to be no different in their implementation of obstructive 'cheat' software  - cheat in terms of the way I have defined 'cheat' above, i.e. secretive implementation of, unbeknown to the 'other guy'.

     

    And finally ask yourself how much it concerns you that there are other forms of assistance out there - how much does it concern you that they are taking money away from the coffers of the WGT corp? competing as effectively as those players who have the money to shell out on all the very best equipment but at a price more available to the common man, thinking about it this way doesn't underground assistance appear as the angel against this form of openly greedy capitalism WGT have demonstrated with their extortionate prices on balls e.t.c.

     

    'only for the very rich this game' - unless you can find an equaliser to it.

     

    deena.

     

    You are making so many assumptions deena...

     

    VEM is not an "anti cheat SW", as you have stated.

     

    Your first two Q and A's are poised up for your assumptions, there is a huge difference between gaining advantage with better equipment and using some sort of cheat SW...if I have to explain it, you just need to play more...or aybe expound on if a player had the best equipment AND Cheat SW, and if Cheat SW were so good, why have better equipment, just use the starter gear and balls?

     

     

    I could go on and pick at things, but in the future, maybe preclude your dissertations with "In my opinion..."

     

    Instead of stating your opinion as fact.

     

     

  • MBaggese
    15,367 Posts
    Thu, Apr 18 2013 2:00 AM

    goldeena:

     

    You are making so many assumptions deena...

     

    > > no, I have taken an entirely pragmatic approach based on hard facts, nothing is assumed - show me. 

     

    VEM is not an "anti cheat SW", as you have stated.

     

    >> VEM is as much an anti-cheat software as it is an attempt to model real life jitters, both definitions are equally accurate - please PROVE otherwise (your comment here is also non pragmatic and without a shred of proof so YOU should really be stating this as 'IN YOUR opinion').

    No, you need to fall back, search the forums if you must, an find out what VEM is...it has NOTHING to do with being an anti cheat program.  Your conclusion, as stated as fact, is just an opinion and should be prefaced as such.

    Your first two Q and A's are poised up for your assumptions, there is a huge difference between gaining advantage with better equipment and using some sort of cheat SW...if I have to explain it, you just need to play more...

     

    >> No, both are identical in their intent in that they provide player enhancement by way of computer assistance, though software may only enable the user to hit the ding, equipment will enable the user to not only hit the ding but also strike further and retain more accuracy and control (subsequent upgrades giving more spin, accuracy and balance) and may therefore be regarded as the superior form of computer assistance - please DO explain more instead of making another broad sweeping statement with no other supporting evidence for it. And NO I don't have to play more to know as much about the game as you, I've served my apprenticeship and have a deep understanding of how things work, besides I try to have a life outside computer games too - please try to be less condescending and remember more games played does not necessarily mean more knowledge gained. 

     

    I'm not being condescending...but if your assumption holds water, then everyone at WGT cheats as they level up an acquire better equipment?


    The player must still hit the meter in the correct spot (notice I did not say "hit the ding") for where they are aiming.


    How is that a form of cheating, especially since WGT allows access to said equipment upgrade?


    So in effect, you are stating that any improvement over starter gear is cheating?

     

    ........or aybe expound on if a player had the best equipment AND Cheat SW, and if Cheat SW were so good, why have better equipment, just use the starter gear and balls?

     

    >> as I have stated pragmatically (with factual evidence), equipment is the superior form of computer aided assistance and would always be sought, perhaps one would use additional software to 'top-up' on that or to compete more equally with folks who can afford all the best gear (a cost effective alternative to re-balance the playing field somewhat).

     

    You have stated, but not provided factual evidence of anything...unless I missed it in your post, but as a mild rebuttal...could a new, never before account holder, start off with R11's, Nike bals, etc, and play any better than a like kind player with starter gear?...I think not.

     

    I could go on and pick at things, but in the future, maybe preclude your dissertations with "In my opinion..."

     

    >> please do go on, I am waiting for some substance instead of a serving of half-baked, vague broad sweeping criticism, I have taken an entirely pragmatic approach therefore there is no need for 'in my opinion', you on the otherhand.......

     

    I've stated fact...some opinion tossed in, but definitely I did not state any of my opinions, or assumptions as a "conclusion", as you did.


    Besides, I know the game well enough to know your conclusions are incorrect...and should be changed to "assumption"


    How you can try to equate better performing equipment to a heat software is intriguing, but incorrect in it's context.  The "enhancement" portion you mentioned is correct...but a "cheat" is beyond an enhancement.


    I'm sure you will agree that the player has to have control of the better equipment in order to get the best from said equipments enhancements.


    A player with a "cheat" does not have to be in control of his/her equipment, they allow the "cheat" to do that for them.


    A very different scenario.

     

     

     

     

    PS, excuse me for the bold lettering, was the best way I could separate out discussion.

  • YankeeJim
    25,827 Posts
    Thu, Apr 18 2013 6:24 AM

    goldeena:

    Q: What have WGT done about it in the past?

    A: Introduced anti-cheat 'cheat' software such as VEM,

    Pardon the interruption here, just a little confused. Cheating came before VEM? I was always under the impression this game revolved around having that patent on VEM. Then, in the course of growth, cheating shows up so WGT creates their own cheat and calls it VEM?

    Oh dear, this is so confusing.  :-(

     

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