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What Happened to the 2 Big Monthly's!?

• xAmazingTrace 122 Posts

  Tue, Feb 1 2022 5:27 PM

  JSmithers:

   

  The issue I have with the cut in credits being offered is that it was difficult and great competition among the top players to try and be in that exclusive top 3.  There are hundreds of tourneys ran that pay top 70 or 60% for ready go.   These were literally the only 2 that paid top 3.  And yes the same group of top players were always near the top battling it out.  So wgt takes a tiny hit on credits entered compared to credits paid out but remember there are also ball hits that go into these tourneys.  Plus many of these top players put the credits right back into the game.  Gifting balls, clubs, passes, creating tourneys for others to win some credits.  IMO the big picture of these 2 out of 100s of tourneys being nerfed will create a negative snowball effect.  Not to mention a lot of these top players stream on twitch and bring more people to the game for free.  Watering down your premium tournaments seems to me like it is going to have a negative effect in the long run. 

  This!

• thunderbird 381 Posts

  Tue, Feb 1 2022 10:26 PM

  Josh is right on here.  The guys that win these events put the money right back into the game.  We have tournaments in our club right now that are paying out over 25000 credits.  These tournies are sponsored by players that win these events.  

  I am all for expanding payouts and expanding purses.  

  By the way dodgyputter I did get my math messed up.  Still 43 dollars a week is 2000 dollars a year for the game which seems a bit high.  Let me buy the annual membership for 169 and give me unlimited balls of my choice and I will never say anything again.  That makes a ton of sense at least to me.  

• DodgyPutter 4,690 Posts

  Wed, Feb 2 2022 2:40 AM

  JSmithers:

  The issue I have with the cut in credits being offered is that it was difficult and great competition among the top players to try and be in that exclusive top 3.  There are hundreds of tourneys ran that pay top 70 or 60% for ready go.   These were literally the only 2 that paid top 3.  And yes the same group of top players were always near the top battling it out.  So wgt takes a tiny hit on credits entered compared to credits paid out but remember there are also ball hits that go into these tourneys.  Plus many of these top players put the credits right back into the game.  Gifting balls, clubs, passes, creating tourneys for others to win some credits.  IMO the big picture of these 2 out of 100s of tourneys being nerfed will create a negative snowball effect.  Not to mention a lot of these top players stream on twitch and bring more people to the game for free.  Watering down your premium tournaments seems to me like it is going to have a negative effect in the long run. 

  It's just my opinion, and I may well be wrong, but I think you're attacking this on too many fronts.

  A regular competition for the top players seems a good idea both for these players to enjoy and for others that want to measure their play against the top players.

  Why is the gifting attractive to wgt?  Give us more credits and we'll be "gifting balls, clubs, passes, creating tourneys for others to win some credits. "  And if you didn't do that those people would need to buy credits from wgt with money?  I don't know about the big effect but if it was true they could switch back and they have some indication (I know it was different) from the last time they slashed the pay-out.

  The elephant in the room of course is that these tournaments needed something done to or about them.  These two tournaments are the primary reasons for a lot of the multi's restarts and sandbagging that goes on. That is at lower levels and obviously wouldn't effect any TC or open to all premium tournament.

  I don't really want to go there on the  streaming but maybe you or wgt could put together a highlight package from each one (I imagine if it was on someone's channel it'd get them a few viewers) as well as some games being live. 

• DodgyPutter 4,690 Posts

  Wed, Feb 2 2022 2:40 AM

  JSmithers:

  The issue I have with the cut in credits being offered is that it was difficult and great competition among the top players to try and be in that exclusive top 3.  There are hundreds of tourneys ran that pay top 70 or 60% for ready go.   These were literally the only 2 that paid top 3.  And yes the same group of top players were always near the top battling it out.  So wgt takes a tiny hit on credits entered compared to credits paid out but remember there are also ball hits that go into these tourneys.  Plus many of these top players put the credits right back into the game.  Gifting balls, clubs, passes, creating tourneys for others to win some credits.  IMO the big picture of these 2 out of 100s of tourneys being nerfed will create a negative snowball effect.  Not to mention a lot of these top players stream on twitch and bring more people to the game for free.  Watering down your premium tournaments seems to me like it is going to have a negative effect in the long run. 

  It's just my opinion, and I may well be wrong, but I think you're attacking this on too many fronts.

  A regular competition for the top players seems a good idea both for these players to enjoy and for others that want to measure their play against the top players.

  Why is the gifting attractive to wgt?  Give us more credits and we'll be "gifting balls, clubs, passes, creating tourneys for others to win some credits. "  And if you didn't do that those people would need to buy credits from wgt with money?  I don't know about the "negative snowball effect"  but if it was true they could switch back and they have some indication (I know it was different) from the last time they slashed the pay-out.

  The elephant in the room of course is that these tournaments needed something done to or about them.  These two tournaments are the primary reasons for a lot of the multi's restarts and sandbagging that goes on. That is at lower levels and obviously wouldn't effect any TC or open to all premium tournament.

  I don't really want to go there on the  streaming but maybe you or wgt could put together a highlight package from each one (I imagine if it was on someone's channel it'd get them a few viewers) as well as some games being live. 

• callaghan159 6,222 Posts

  Wed, Feb 2 2022 3:47 AM

  DodgyPutter:

  Why is the gifting attractive to wgt?  Give us more credits and we'll be "gifting balls, clubs, passes, creating tourneys for others to win some credits. "  And if you didn't do that those people would need to buy credits from wgt with money? 

  
  
  +1......Was thinking the exact same thing. 

• Schmails3 168 Posts

  Wed, Feb 2 2022 6:15 AM

  callaghan159:

  DodgyPutter:

  Why is the gifting attractive to wgt?  Give us more credits and we'll be "gifting balls, clubs, passes, creating tourneys for others to win some credits. "  And if you didn't do that those people would need to buy credits from wgt with money? 

  
  
  +1......Was thinking the exact same thing. 

  Many wont spend money to begin with so they end up quitting the game fairly quick after starting out.  This keeps lower level players playing and getting them to a point where they may spend money and keeps the game growing.  I think relying on everyone to spend money to keep playing would diminish alot of the players we currently have.  Its a fine line with that and growing the game.

• JSmithers 1,263 Posts

  Wed, Feb 2 2022 7:23 AM

  DodgyPutter:

  Why is the gifting attractive to wgt?  Give us more credits and we'll be "gifting balls, clubs, passes, creating tourneys for others to win some credits. "  And if you didn't do that those people would need to buy credits from wgt with money?  I don't know about the "negative snowball effect"  but if it was true they could switch back and they have some indication (I know it was different) from the last time they slashed the pay-out.

  Gifting balls, clubs etc should be attractive to the players.  The same ones that want these tourneys slashed to the point they can win part of their entry fee back.  If i was wgt i'd want my top players gifting clubs balls and passes to other players.  I'd want that type of free advertising.  Many of these top players play a high end ball.  I can't tell you the # of people I have seen switch to these high end balls to try and compete at that level.  

  WGT has took their two premium tournaments and watered them down to the point they are no different than the rest.  

  Participation trophies for everyone!! thanks for playing heres a credit

   

   

• DodgyPutter 4,690 Posts

  Wed, Feb 2 2022 12:20 PM

  JSmithers:

  Participation trophies for everyone!! thanks for playing heres a credit

  Ok, but I still think  it would have been better to keep this to wanting a tournament for top players for sporting reasons.

  JSmithers:

  Gifting balls, clubs etc should be attractive to the players.  The same ones that want these tourneys slashed to the point they can win part of their entry fee back. 

  Yes players getting gifts probably is attractive to the people getting the gifts, I'm not sure what I'm missing there but apologies for not seeing it. 

  JSmithers:

  If i was wgt i'd want my top players gifting clubs balls and passes to other players.  I'd want that type of free advertising.

  If wgt thought players getting equipment for free was good for them surely they would give it themselves, sometimes they do but they don't select who to.  I don't see how you doing it is  this "free advertising" surely wgt doing it would be that.  Players have to have discovered wgt before they discover you.

  JSmithers:

  Many of these top players play a high end ball.  I can't tell you the # of people I have seen switch to these high end balls to try and compete at that level.  

  I've got over that it seems certain people can do what they like but you don't get to use that to prove a point.  If people are offered something like "A sleeve for a $5 sub" they are hardly likely to pick 50c balls, are they?  That doesn't mean you are convincing ordinary low level players to use expensive balls.  It doesn't even mean wgt are profiting from the expensive ones you are seeing "sold".

• MattSutherland 108 Posts

  Wed, Feb 2 2022 1:23 PM

  JSmithers:

  Participation trophies for everyone!! thanks for playing heres a credit

  Well that's just it too. Nothing about this helps the average player - it just cons them into entering an event they're going to lose credits on. At least when it was top 3, there were giant unspoken warning signs that you're probably not winning anything unless you're good enough to hang.

  With it being top 70, though, your average player thinks he/she can play well enough to earn those credits back. When, in reality, they're just losing money. WGT is really good at making it seem like we're getting ahead in RGs, brackets, etc. when we're actually just breaking even.

  And I know the natural response to that from some will be 'well, it's better than when they used to give us nothing' but that's nonsense too. If I enter, play like trash, and WD. Whatever. I have enough credits to spare. But when credits are tight and you're just learning the game? Man, that sucks. I mean, it's great business for WGT but it absolutely rakes middle of the road players into believing they're coming out ahead when they're really not.

• SamSpayed 4,902 Posts

  Wed, Feb 2 2022 1:52 PM

  I've been reading the posts in this thread, and this is the quick summary as I understand it to this point.

  A few of the better players, primarily from Cobra Kai, want more credits to be paid out in tournaments, especially for the top places, so that (a) they can buy better balls and (b) gift more credits and equipment to their fellow CC members.

  Do I have that right?

  And, then of course, there's this:

  thunderbird:

  I think what MasterHacker (Don) said is probably accurate, you will see the top players really limit what they play. 

  Is this supposed to be a threat?  If so, it's a pretty empty one.  If some of you so-called "top players" start limiting what you play, I'm sure other players will step in to take your place.  You are not irreplaceable.  

  The arrogance on display here is pretty incredible.