Forums

Ok seriously ..... suggestions with a bit of griping

• monkeyass 31 Posts

  Fri, May 29 2009 12:45 AM

  Quick stat.

  Angel Cabrera's Driving accuracy is at 47% (ranked 190th).  But his average drive is 300 yards.  Its not like hes won the masters or anything.  Oh wait he has.

  Mark Brook - the driving accuracy leader at almost 80% has only had 3 top ten finishes in the last four years.  But wait, he still hits the ball 260 yards.

  If we are going to play the real, tough courses, then we shouldn't be hampered by a grandmas stats.

  It's not always about the driver either.  I hit my real life 8 iron a solid 160 yards (I got a hole in one recently with it, I should know).  in the game, 125.  Thats a big discrepancy.

  I'm up for a good challange, but if we play from the pro tees, we should be closer to the pro's stats.  My two cents

• Thetruth67 158 Posts

  Fri, May 29 2009 7:58 AM

  Again I understand your desire for more distance. I am simply pointing out that if they bump up the distance to what the pros average then they have to have a proportionate  decrease in accuracy.  So as I said, if you are in the rough 40-50% of the time you are still not going to be on in two on the long par 4's. 

  Also the decrease would need to occur with the irons as well.  Tour average GIR is 63.89%, I currently average 78% and I am sure there are people that average higher than that.  Take that GIR down to 64% and I think the scores would still be about the same as where they currently are.

  This is what it comes down to...

  Bethpage Black is every bit as difficult for the pros as it is playing on this game.   WARNING - The Black Course Is An Extremely Difficult Course Which We Recommend Only For Highly Skilled Golfers," reads a big bold sign on the fence at the first tee.  Also, a quote from  Danny Sink, the USGA's on-site coordinator for the Open "Our focus is to identify the very best golfer the week of the championship and to bring that out, To really challenge them with different shots, different yardages and different challenges that they don't see every day."

  

   

   

  A couple of facts for you

  • Woods was the only golfer to break par in 2002
  • some players who had too much difficulty on No. 10 and No. 12 complained, These are par 4 holes where the average score was about 4.5 during the championship.  Remember the holes where the pros complained that they couldn't even reach the fairway from the tee? Sound familiar?

  I understand the complaints about distance, but based on the scores posted it is playing pretty close to the way the actual course plays.  With the PGA's name attached to our virtual US Open, I am quite positive they do not want to see some one win firing 9 or 10 under par. 

   

• Thetruth67 158 Posts

  Fri, May 29 2009 8:09 AM

  As for Angel Cabrera

  He has 3 career wins and has been cut from 5 of 9 events.  So, yes he may have won a two majors, but look at his year (cut over 50% of the time) or even career (has missed the cut 21 out of 63 events) and you will see it is  mediocre. 

  So far this year...

  2/1/2009	FBR Open	Cut	-
  2/22/2009	Northern Trust Open	13
  3/8/2009	The Honda Classic	32
  3/29/2009	Arnold Palmer Invitational presented by MasterCard	Cut	-
  4/5/2009	Shell Houston Open	Cut	-
  4/12/2009	The Masters	1	-
  5/3/2009	Quail Hollow Championship	Cut	-
  5/10/2009	The Players Championship	14
  5/24/2009	BMW PGA Championship	Cut	-

• monkeyass 31 Posts

  Fri, May 29 2009 8:12 AM

  I don't remember pros complaining about not being able to reach the fairways but I have a bad memory.  My point is that driving accuracy does not mean better scores.  I picked two people, one from the bottom of the list and one from the top of the list (driving accuracy).  The most accurate driver has 2 PGA top ten finishes.  One of the least accurate people has won a masters.

  The lowest driving average is 250 yards.  My WGT stat is 230.  So if it is going to have the PGA name on it, I would expect to have middle of the road stats, not worse than the worst. Thats my only point.  I understand that BB is really tough.  But when we are not playing better than the worst PGA tour player (on a PGA difficulty level course), it seems a little... unfair (especially after upgrading clubs).

  Oh and Cabrara was just a quick example, as I remembered that he won a major when I saw his name at the bottom of the list.

   

• ToughCool 70 Posts

  Fri, May 29 2009 8:16 AM

  I'm so glad you wrote this. Thanks. I also think that the the elevations grab WAY too many balls. Example is No. 4 at BPB..the par 5. If you can hit it 210 to a spot than the traps shouldn't grab it.

  As for the argument about Tiger, etc....it doesn't matter. The goal of the game is to play a course as realistically as possible. If the pros hit is 285 off the tee and yet have bad days and spray it into the rough, then that should be our option too. It's why Tiger goes a 3-Wood stinger off the tee sometimes...he is all over the place. The goal isn't to be so far back that you are having to hit a perfect wedge from 100 yards to par. I guarantee you Tiger wouldn't take that. The course is tough because of thick rough, slick greens and tough hole placement. It shouldn't be tough because the Burner clubs I just purchased still make half the Par 4s, Par 5s. That is not what course difficulty mean and it is why pros upgrade their equipment...to get an edge and to hit is further, etc. I guarantee you that Cabrerra wouldn't trade his majors because 5 times he missed cuts. It goes with the territory and should be our territory to attempt also. Part of the game is club selection depending on accuracy. It's a large part. That should be a choice we have too.

• Thetruth67 158 Posts

  Fri, May 29 2009 8:17 AM

  The problem is you are looking at one stat and that is distance.  If you look at the overall final scores and the cut line that are being posted we are performing at a level consistent with the actual event.  In fact with several under-par rounds being posted, the players at WGT have performed better than what was actually posted by tour professionals in 2002

• ToughCool 70 Posts

  Fri, May 29 2009 8:21 AM

  Thetruth, it doesn't matter....it's not realistic no matter how you try to spin the scores here. Every pro playing the US Open has the option to knock the driver out 275 and give up accuracy. That is fact. If they aren't acurate they opt for a 3-Wood or hybrid. Club selection is part of the game. Not one of them is hitting two flush shots and still hitting wedge into a par 4....on 5-6 holes. Sorry.

• mosherkl 110 Posts

  Fri, May 29 2009 9:54 AM

  I have to agree with the pro-distance argument here. If WGT wants to be the most realistic, they should attempt to mimic real golf as much as possible. Not just in scores. Take away accuracy and give me a 270 average drive. And just as with the pros and most competent golfers, accuracy will get better as you progress from driver down to wedges. As it stands now, I'm likely to shank a PW just as far from my aim point as I might shank a drive.

  Regardless of how close to realistic the scores may be, to be the most realistic game you should take as close a PATH to getting there as possible. If that means quicker meters for all clubs to reduce perfect strokes, so be it. But if I hit that perfect stroke, I would expect to be able to get TO the fairway on all the holes of BPB.

• Thetruth67 158 Posts

  Fri, May 29 2009 10:25 AM

  I guess I should have realized it earlier, but I assume you are using stock or tour starter clubs. 

  Ok so here is the fix...buy the R9 driver and you will make every fairway virtually every round barring a mishit.  I bought the R9 roughly 3 days ago and would guess the avg. drive to be 240+, which makes sense since with the original clubs (rated for for 220) my average was 224. 

  If everything is left the same I would guess that Tibbets and Lee will score somewhere in the -9 range in a couple of weeks.  Add distance to the clubs and they will be underpar well into the double digits.   

   

• ToughCool 70 Posts

  Fri, May 29 2009 10:39 AM

  I purchased the Taylor Made...full set with Driver, 3W, etc the other day and while it helped immensely in some places it still left 4 or so Par 4s that could not be reached in 2 and where a wedge from the fairway was needed for par. In fact 3 of them were hard to even reach the fairway with the drive. That isn't realistic. That's the point. I'm sure their practice gets their scores that low but I'm trying to figure how it says they average 285 a drive. When you read come of the hole explanations like No. 4..th ePar 5, they talk about it being a birdie hole that has a chance of being hit in 2. To me it is one of the hardest and it is impossible to reach in 2...in fact..sometimes you can't reach Tier 2 in 2. So the game doesn't follow the flavor of the course.