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Sat, Dec 2 2023 10:58 PM (10 replies)
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  • 1Universurfr
    46 Posts
    Mon, May 29 2023 9:53 PM

    When a golfer with a posted average of 72, plays coin games & shoots 8 birdies for 9 holes, and the score NEVER affects his average, there is more than 1 thing wrong with this picture !

    The player is at best dishonest, and WGT is complicit. 

  • AlaskanDame
    19,167 Posts
    Tue, May 30 2023 4:00 PM

    You’re a Legend.  What tier was the opponent?   Don’t see dishonesty.  If ranked rounds aren’t played, they don’t affect average.  They MIGHT affect tier, if the player beats higher tier players consistently — but won’t affect average.

  • pmm711
    5,559 Posts
    Wed, May 31 2023 4:15 AM

    1Universurfr:

    When a golfer with a posted average of 72, plays coin games & shoots 8 birdies for 9 holes, and the score NEVER affects his average, there is more than 1 thing wrong with this picture !

    The player is at best dishonest, and WGT is complicit. 

    You’ve been around long enough to know….

    1) Coin matches are practice and not ranked rounds so don’t affect one’s average.  

    2) The player had a good practice round and isn’t dishonest

    3) WGT is WGT

     

  • bossbird
    2,200 Posts
    Wed, May 31 2023 4:34 AM

    Seems to me you just don’t like losing to someone better than you. Don’t forget it’s just a game , to be played for fun . If you don’t like the game there is an easy answer. 

  • 1Universurfr
    46 Posts
    Thu, Jun 1 2023 8:11 AM

    How do you know what I know ?                                                                                                                  

    The player has a posted 72 average and ridiculously low number of recorded rounds, with a high number of NON RECORDED rounds...that spells CHEATER

     

    The player did NOT have a good round, it is a vile cheater

     

    How much does WGT pay you to fluff their fuzzy ??? 

  • WGTShamWow
    910 Posts
    Thu, Jun 1 2023 10:37 AM

    1Universurfr:

    How do you know what I know ?                                                                                                                  

    The player has a posted 72 average and ridiculously low number of recorded rounds, with a high number of NON RECORDED rounds...that spells CHEATER

    The player did NOT have a good round, it is a vile cheater

    How much does WGT pay you to fluff their fuzzy ??? 

    There are a lot of players that primarily, if not exclusively, play Coin Room Rounds. These rounds aren't counted as ranked rounds as most of the room types don't mee the minimum 9 holes to count towards some ones average. As these don't count as ranked rounds, you can run into players that will have a high average, sometimes the default 150 average if they have never played a ranked round, and be really good at the game. They wouldn't be cheating. 

    Think about it this way, you go to a golf course that also has a pitch and putt course. You play against someone on this pitch and putt course that almost never plays a full 9 or 18 hole round, but they come out to this pitch and putt course 5 days a week and have been for years. Their handicap is abysmal for 18 holes but they are landing these shots within inches of the hole if not holing out on these shots. Would you say that person is cheating or is it just that they have preference for the type of game they like to play?

    Best,
    WGTShamWow

     

  • 1Universurfr
    46 Posts
    Thu, Jun 1 2023 4:05 PM

    Thank you for your detailed / articulate explanation!

    I apologize to all the players that I suspected of cheating.

    Why does WGT allow this to happen... Players that are obviously highly skilled, but only ( or mostly) play rounds that keep their average high. 

    The example I cited was for 9 holes... so for 18 holes this person likely has a 54 average, while shooting as a legend with a 72 average. 

    How can it be proper, justified, or fair, for a person that shoots 54, but is listed as a 72 average?

    At least in the NON coin games, I can choose to NOT play certain players... but in the coin games, there is NO OPTION to reject a player.

    If it is NOT proprietary information, exactly how does WGT "choose" players for the coin games? 

    Thank you, ,

    1universurfr

  • WGTShamWow
    910 Posts
    Thu, Jun 1 2023 6:01 PM

    1Universurfr:

    Thank you for your detailed / articulate explanation!

    I apologize to all the players that I suspected of cheating.

    Why does WGT allow this to happen... Players that are obviously highly skilled, but only ( or mostly) play rounds that keep their average high. 

    The example I cited was for 9 holes... so for 18 holes this person likely has a 54 average, while shooting as a legend with a 72 average. 

    How can it be proper, justified, or fair, for a person that shoots 54, but is listed as a 72 average?

    At least in the NON coin games, I can choose to NOT play certain players... but in the coin games, there is NO OPTION to reject a player.

    If it is NOT proprietary information, exactly how does WGT "choose" players for the coin games? 

    Thank you, ,

    1universurfr

    Well, it wouldn't be that these players are intentionally trying to keep their average high, its just that they don't play ranked rounds. I think the bigger issue is that you are trying to apply a stat that isn't recorded in this game mode to judge how good a player is in this game mode. It would be nice if we had a different ranking system for Coin Room rounds, like an overall player rank based specifically on coin room rounds wins, losses, rooms played, etc. or something like that. The only thing you can really look at right now that would accurately reflect how well someone plays in coin room rounds would probably be their non ranked stats. For example, if a player has 1300 unranked rounds and has 500 unranked birdies, it would be safe to assume they are pretty good at the game even if they had a 74 average. 

    Coin rooms would be a bit different than regular ranked or tournament rounds as well. They tend to have easier course conditions and allow for apparel bonuses, where rounds that count towards your average don't. This would also be why they dont count towards a players average. 

    For matchmaking, the game is looking at things like level, tier, wins/losses, opponents, how well you play, etc. 

    Best,
    WGTShamWow

  • PureGro1
    1,656 Posts
    Fri, Jun 2 2023 5:23 AM

    WGTShamWow:

    For matchmaking, the game is looking at things like level, tier, wins/losses, opponents, how well you play, etc. 

    Best,
    WGTShamWow

    Good job explaining the coin rooms, This last part though...was this misspoken? IIRC we were just told recently by Nico? perhaps, that it is a random draw to be paired in coin rooms.

    My own exp with coin room games is that it is random.

  • DodgyPutter
    4,690 Posts
    Fri, Jun 2 2023 12:03 PM

    WGTShamWow:
    For example, if a player has 1300 unranked rounds and has 500 unranked birdies, it would be safe to assume they are pretty good at the game even if they had a 74 average. 

    Nice to see some interpretation used :-)  Some stats have been recorded since quite a few updates ago (was it Summer '22?), like unranked rounds, that mean you could go a bit further. 

    Since that update the person he's referring to has played 1976 others (almost certainly coin games).  He has won 1,439 so has a 73% win record.  He plays in many of the rooms winning:

    Paris            110 

    Chelsea       112

    BH                 87 

    Casa'           158

    Rio               521

    Shanghai      190

    Mont'             213

    Tokyo              12

    Manhattan        3

    Monaco           33

    In these games he's played 6,263 holes for which he's -2,151.  -0.3434 per hole and -6.18  for 18 holes.  I reckon he had a good round with the -8, it happens to us all, no more than that.

    His ranked rounds were some time ago, outside his score history, and it's likely his equipment has improved since then.  Throw in apparel, short tees on some courses and often favourable gs, and holes in the shorter games and you'd expect lower scores. 

    He almost certainly played coin games before these stat's were recorded, joined Feb 2019.

    I think it's true that the tier system is very much against people who play rr's/in favour of coin players.  Although there would be flaws with basing things on level too I reckon it would be fairer. 

    WGTShamWow:
    For matchmaking, the game is looking at things like level, tier, wins/losses, opponents, how well you play, etc. 

    I too wonder exactly what you mean by that.

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