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Wed, May 19 2021 4:54 PM (21 replies)
  • SimonTheBeetle
    2,404 Posts
    Thu, May 13 2021 6:18 PM

    hpurey:

    Would be interesting to know when this L33 player joined WGT.  They could have been someone with lots of game knowledge that played before levels were a thing and started off at L30 and came back after a long time away from WGT.  If you're good enough it doesn't take that long to get back into the swing of things (pun intended). 

    But the OP is a L75 Tour Pro.  Seems to me that someone isn't learning much while moving up the levels.

    I agree.

    However, a L33 player who scores -9 with the default beginner's gears (I assume that includes the putter) under the conditions of heavy winds and very fast greens does smell fishy, too.

    I think there are very very few genuinely "new" players who are coming into this game now. I firmly suspect most of them are restarters either legitimate or (mostly) illegitimate. One of the indications is... how often do you see someone asking about the game play (putting, shot making, calculations, etc.) these days in the forums? Almost none! There are, of course, already sufficient data & info gathered & posted over the years, but I doubt they would search and find them all right away without consulting us the precedents. That was the only thing I was doing in the forums at my early stage : asking questions after questions on the game play.

    As a matter of fact, this is a dilemma most of old games face over time, eventually becoming a pond of stagnant water, only the strongest or fittest survive, not to mention sports simulation games are now old trends to make the matter worse. Youngsters don't play this kind of game any more. The popularity of golf itself has been drastically declining too. Golf is too slow and boring for young people who are used to more fast-paced "pungent" stuff now. Well, I'll stop here since it's another topic that deserves a separate discussion.

  • hpurey
    11,189 Posts
    Fri, May 14 2021 3:44 AM

    SimonTheBeetle:
    However, a L33 player who scores -9 with the default beginner's gears (I assume that includes the putter) under the conditions of heavy winds and very fast greens does smell fishy, too.

    Great point, even if said player had the best equipment available at L33.  

     

    SimonTheBeetle:

    I think there are very very few genuinely "new" players who are coming into this game now. I firmly suspect most of them are restarters either legitimate or (mostly) illegitimate. One of the indications is... how often do you see someone asking about the game play (putting, shot making, calculations, etc.) these days in the forums? Almost none! There are, of course, already sufficient data & info gathered & posted over the years, but I doubt they would search and find them all right away without consulting us the precedents. That was the only thing I was doing in the forums at my early stage : asking questions after questions on the game play.

    As a matter of fact, this is a dilemma most of old games face over time, eventually becoming a pond of stagnant water, only the strongest or fittest survive, not to mention sports simulation games are now old trends to make the matter worse. Youngsters don't play this kind of game any more. The popularity of golf itself has been drastically declining too. Golf is too slow and boring for young people who are used to more fast-paced "pungent" stuff now. Well, I'll stop here since it's another topic that deserves a separate discussion.

    Well said Simon.  

  • Tabarnak777
    93 Posts
    Fri, May 14 2021 6:09 AM

    With half of greens reachable in 1 due to baby tees and apparels mixed with high(back) winds i don't suspect anything special for the moment. I doubt he can do it on and on, you just stomped into a good game from him.

    I see a 27 pretty often from legend tees in 9 holes tourneys with medium winds so i'm not impressed about the results you have seen.

    The main problem of relating such scores is that there is no extra data to confirm if a player is a cheater or not. A good game does happen from time to time and everyone can hit one some day or another.

  • TOPMIXER11
    6 Posts
    Fri, May 14 2021 12:47 PM

    But his whole history was 33  average from day 1 to level 33 that's my point 

  • DodgyPutter
    3,912 Posts
    Fri, May 14 2021 1:54 PM

    AnaNikolaj:
    But even the ones that said restarts were allowed, stated players weren't allowed to play any credit involved tournaments, until they reached the tier of their original account. Even WGT free tourneys with credit prizes.

    It sounds like a restart to me but I don't think (I'm obviously not certain) that they're focused on winning credits.

    From the description it looks like this was a 9 hole sp friendly, as it seems unlikely to have got to the 9th as mp, and this person carded a net 54.  If that is the case he didn't cheat anyone, here at least, he cut his average and the op got his 35/70.  Without knowing who it is or what "full swing edge level 6 apparel" does I don't really know what was going on here.

  • TopShelf2010
    10,277 Posts
    Fri, May 14 2021 1:57 PM

    .

  • DodgyPutter
    3,912 Posts
    Fri, May 14 2021 1:57 PM

    TOPMIXER11:
    But his whole history was 33  average from day 1 to level 33 that's my point 

    Whether it's 33 or 34 I'm not sure what you mean by that.  Every score?

  • AnaNikolaj
    270 Posts
    Fri, May 14 2021 3:21 PM

    DodgyPutter:

    AnaNikolaj:
    But even the ones that said restarts were allowed, stated players weren't allowed to play any credit involved tournaments, until they reached the tier of their original account. Even WGT free tourneys with credit prizes.

    It sounds like a restart to me but I don't think (I'm obviously not certain) that they're focused on winning credits.

    From the description it looks like this was a 9 hole sp friendly, as it seems unlikely to have got to the 9th as mp, and this person carded a net 54.  If that is the case he didn't cheat anyone, here at least, he cut his average and the op got his 35/70.  Without knowing who it is or what "full swing edge level 6 apparel" does I don't really know what was going on here.

     

    Swing edge adds distance to your clubs (for the most part). As for my comment, I neither know nor care whether said player was or wasn't a restart. It was simply a correction of Mythanatos' post regarding WGT's stance on restarts ;-) 

  • pdb1
    22,280 Posts
    Fri, May 14 2021 3:22 PM

    TOPMIXER11:

    I played a level 33 yesterday  who scored 9 under  on st Andrews Inc 2 eagles with heavy winds and very fast greens player had beginners clubs , and full swing edge level 6 apparel .when I looked at profile they had average 34 on all courses for 9 holes .was this a cheat ifso HOW

    SimonTheBeetle:

    You look even more suspicious, I mean... mysterious

      Not really comparatively to the massive unknown numbers of long time original Mobile players . With MEGA experience not properly visible in stats . Who also may or may not be playing PCEA as well .

       Hypothetically . The possibility that some are " innocent sandbaggers " . With no cause reason to divulge anything .

    Mythanatos:
    It's a reroll. Which WGT is ok with as long as they aren't playing multiple accounts at same time.

    TOPMIXER11:
    re roll what does this mean  .

      Good question .

    TopShelf2010:

    Restart... player starts over with a different account APPROVED by WGT going through the proper channels.

    Note: When starting over you begin again with nothing you had before... clubs/credits/balls/etc.

    Mythanatos:
    It's a reroll. Which WGT is ok with as long as they aren't playing multiple accounts at same time.

     

    AnaNikolaj:
    Well, there were mixed info on that subject from different mods. Including one that said WGT does not allow restarting. But even the ones that said restarts were allowed, stated players weren't allowed to play any credit involved tournaments, until they reached the tier of their original account. Even WGT free tourneys with credit prizes. Problem is, I really don't think they're able to enforce this policy, at least not on a scale that'd make a difference. But there were cases, where restarts were suddenly found out and promoted a few tiers over night, only to be eventually banned some time after that. 

      All good points . But are forgetting 1 very important part .

      When WGT approves a restart . The restarter is told that the previous account will be deleted .

      There fore a second ( known ) account would not be playable . This happens more times than not .

      I know a few examples . I also know 1 in particular . 1 whom everyone else knows . That has gone through this process 4 times . Restart Hack to 1st TL . Then to Champion . Those were the highest levels at the time . And twice to T C . Legitimately .

      The previous accounts deleted each time . In Flash PC . Where all stats are visible throughout the entire tier up journey .

      If there are similar cases in the Mobile platform . No one would be aware of anything the player is currently doing .

    hpurey:
    Would be interesting to know when this L33 player joined WGT.  They could have been someone with lots of game knowledge that played before levels were a thing and started off at L30 and came back after a long time away from WGT.  If you're good enough it doesn't take that long to get back into the swing of things (pun intended).

      Also another possibility and a good likely example .

    SimonTheBeetle:
    However, a L33 player who scores -9 with the default beginner's gears (I assume that includes the putter) under the conditions of heavy winds and very fast greens does smell fishy, too.

      Not . Sorry Simon . I play those types almost everyday . Some are too silent to respond to my innocent inquiries about how long they have been playing . Or does he like his hybrid . Or you do know that better equipment really makes this game funner and easier .

      Some will talk a little . " About 5 years " or " Hybrid , why do you ask ? " or " Yeah , thought about it , can't really afford it . "

      So I sometimes go to their profile to find that most have been playing for several years or much longer .

      But obviously did not peruse the forums . Like we did . Because in the Mobile platform . It is/was an isolated single player atmosphere . With the exception of coins . With no emphasis on directing anyone towards the WGT UNIVERSE or the Forums .

      So that is part of my point . Whether or not they knew full well that there was/is an already established protocol .

      They are protected by " PLAUSIBLE DENIABILITY " . What they don't know or can easily claim not to know . Won't hurt them .

      And hindsight is 20/20 . But even before that . This whole grey area of unknown stats and experience . Could have been addressed . At the outset of the Mobile platform . Eliminating today's uncertainty and the debates on who what and how much .

      But here we are . In a place where there are even more possible scenarios than mentioned here . And no way to prove anything .

     

    SimonTheBeetle:
    I think there are very very few genuinely "new" players who are coming into this game now. I firmly suspect most of them are restarters either legitimate or (mostly) illegitimate.

    SimonTheBeetle:
    One of the indications is... how often do you see someone asking about the game play (putting, shot making, calculations, etc.) these days in the forums? Almost none! There are, of course, already sufficient data & info gathered & posted over the years, but I doubt they would search and find them all right away without consulting us the precedents. That was the only thing I was doing in the forums at my early stage : asking questions after questions on the game play.

      So I contend that none of them are cheating and are protected by the lack of the host to prevent all of this .

     

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  • SimonTheBeetle
    2,404 Posts
    Sun, May 16 2021 4:28 AM

    I just wrote what I think is happening, but I also respect your opinions, Paul. You might be right as well as I might be. Who knows...

    But you play almost everyday with those who can shoot -9 with the starter's clubs on a 9-hole round?? Boy... can you imagine what they'd be able to do with the clubs we play with?! LOL ;-)

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