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Showdown Issues

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Wed, Feb 19 2020 4:10 PM (38 replies)
  • el3n1
    4,273 Posts
    Mon, Dec 9 2019 8:36 AM

    Until the major issues with the showdown that effect scoring are fixed, these while still beneficial for some.. completely undermine the integrity of a fair competition...

    All too frequently, players are disconnecting or quiting games that can adversely effect a players score with a bogey or more... or on the other hand as noted elsewhere, a player can lose a match by a player holing out a shot and the loser is still awarded a birdie or eagle themselves... 

    I have played in all three showdowns and 2 out of 3 times my score has been impacted by players quitting... a major factor contributing to this is -- WGT is using low stakes coin rooms for the matches, which are prone to such behavior... at least in the higher stakes, players tend to be more respectful and complete their matches most of the time and they are set on back tees.

    My first event, I mistakenly played rookie, which is understandable as everyone starts familiarizing themselves with the event.... but we are also seeing TC and mobile specialist that are more than likely diamond division players - slumming it in the rookie division... this is ridiculous as well.

    Every other facet of the game... forces promotion for winning … you see it in coin division, you see it as players tier up, you see it as players do well in credit tournaments, but the showdowns seemingly are the only exception where Expert players can slum it in lower divisions to dominant against others.

    Now, I may be able to understand not wanting to wager 1000 credits on an event that is prone to glitches that impact scoring but when top players repeatedly play and win top 10 in rookie -- why are they not being forced to play higher stakes --- as they are in every other facet of the game?

    You could possibly argue even some in the Veteran category are doing the same thing... I believe 21 under is a mere 1 stroke behind what I heard/read Fmagnets shot in Expert.  I haven't checked to confirm if this were the final results but likely.

    Come on WGT... are you only interested in trying to extract as much coin/credits out of your members or are you concerned with fair competition... any action or lack whereof will let your members know where you stand.  If nothing is done, I will simply avoid the events and refrain from encouraging others to participate.  

    As it stands now... it has great potential and is a fresh event for members to participate in, but you really need to fix the issues.  

    And, for goodness sakes… you are now giving people jacked up sponsor apparel... get off the crazy forward tees already... you really think the courses play as challenging when scores like 22 and 21 under are being shot???  

    thanks for listening... others may add or disagree but the problems still need fixed.

    ok, I need to ice my hands now... too much typing LOL

  • BronxBarrons154
    23 Posts
    Mon, Dec 9 2019 9:01 AM

    I am confused.  When I signed up for the Showdown, I subscribed to what I could afford; in this case, 10 credits.  On none of the holes I played did I hit from the most forward tees.  The tees were all in accordance with my tier level which happens to be Master.

    Alternatively, if the person I was paired with was of a lesser tier, i.e., Pro, Tour Pro, I saw them tee off from more forward tee boxes.  With this said, I am not seeing the issue.

    (PS- I often wish I could hit from Champion tees.  You have more course to work with ­čśť)

  • Dbocho
    243 Posts
    Mon, Dec 9 2019 9:37 AM

    Well said - divisions should be done by tier, and eliminate people quitting the second they don't get the best possible score on the hole.  

    Tour champions to playing against much lower tiers, and then having they ability to be quitting and starting over is ridiculous.

    Fun to play, but understandable concerns. 

  • BOZskills
    326 Posts
    Mon, Dec 9 2019 9:43 AM

    E,i agree with you on some of the points. Personally i didn't have any issues with the forfeiting. I believe about half my matches wound up in forfeits and the game simple continued with me playing alone (which i found quite relaxing). Another issue is like the TC playing in the rookie division,at least in doing so since they are playing in paris room,they are playing from tier specific tees. I don't see how playing in higher (worthless)coin rooms is going to prevent players from forfeiting,once you're out of the match what's the point is the veiw of a large segment of the wgt community. There's just very little courtesy. I've said this in a previous thread that why not have all the divisions play in the Paris room (the amount of the worthless coins is completely irrelevant,we're playing for tournament prizes),this way everyone would be playing from their teir specific tees jmo.

  • TheProeb
    41 Posts
    Mon, Dec 9 2019 10:09 AM

    I agree.

    I also don't understand the need for this to be a head to head competition. If you want to break down rounds into three hole increments fine, add a timer too if need be, but the fact that opponents have zero significance toward a competitor's results, yet can negatively impact their final scores is ridiculous.

    I also am perturbed over the lack of customer service during the event. I played the first two showdowns without issue miraculously, however, in the final 3 holes of the final round of this showdown I couldn't find an opponent to be matched up (again ridiculous in an of itself) so I cancelled the search and resubmitted only to find that "my showdown had concluded" because I had "played all the holes." I figured this would sort itself out, but nope, I was given 3 bogeys moving my score from -12 through 15 holes (4 shots out of first place in my veteran division) to -9 for the round (good for a 67th overall finish). A far cry from the prizes missed out on from 3 more pars or better.

    I guess my only real option would've been to let the "finding opponent" search to continue for however long it would've taken.

    I would've at least liked the acknowledgement that WGT received any of my requests for assistance over the weekend, but I'm not holding out hope at this point.

    100 credits is minor in the grand scheme of things, but it's still discouraging that this issue can happen again next showdown.

     

  • garyk49
    2,104 Posts
    Mon, Dec 9 2019 10:19 AM

    I just played my first one.  I too, did not know there were different divisions and played in the rookie division.

    But in reality, I was a rookie, having not played the early access that much.  It is a new way of putting for me, as I use movements for distance.  I also have my putter moves calculated for the different green speeds.

    It makes me wonder.  None that I played were even in the Tournament.  I always hit the play now and it hunted for an opponent.  Never, never, did I even see a name that I recognized, makes me wonder if the mobile and early access is filled with multi's.  Getting to your statement that those quitting affected you.  It always took me back into the game and allowed me to finish my 3 holes.  Those quitting had no effect on my score.  Remember it was your score against the field of players, not who you just played.

    Yep it took me to Paris for every round. Who I played against(I believe) were people that wanted to play in the Paris room, not those just in the tournament(would never get a game is only playing those).  Most played through all the holes, did have some quit partways through, and 1 quit right after he joined.  The one thing that did effect me tho.  In the final round, playing my first three holes.  Hit play now, just as it found a player(didn't even get a chance to see who it was)the game said that golf.exe had stopped working and dumped me back to the desktop.  Went back and looked, it had scored me as +3.

    The one big thing I did notice tho.  NOT VERY TALKATIVE.  Not even at the start of the game.  I said the usual of Hi, gl and hf the first time,  also added some nice shots, not a peep back, then after that just played.  I will keep to myself what I think of the mobile group.



  • BogeyOne
    1,825 Posts
    Mon, Dec 9 2019 10:35 AM

    garyk49:

     

    The one big thing I did notice tho.  NOT VERY TALKATIVE.  Not even at the start of the game.  I said the usual of Hi, gl and hf the first time,  also added some nice shots, not a peep back, then after that just played.  I will keep to myself what I think of the mobile group.

     

    They may not be seeing your chat. Chat can be toggled on or off in the game settings. I frequently have it turned off just because I want every distraction possible eliminated so as to more readily deal with the limitations of the 45 second shot clock.

     

  • el3n1
    4,273 Posts
    Mon, Dec 9 2019 11:30 AM

    garyk49:
    It always took me back into the game and allowed me to finish my 3 holes. 

    I believe this is how it is suppose to work, but unfortunately it doesn't always happen.  I have been forced to take bogies and I have been forced to replay holes when my scores did not save … this is better than nothing but if you have good conditions and have a good score going you can lose a stroke in the next round... consider Chambers Bay in Heavy winds versus low winds and 7.9 greens... one is easier than the other... 

    At least in WGT tournaments while some may get more favorable winds than others... everyone is playing heavy winds on the same course... imagine the uproar if the WGT VT allowed some players low wind and slow greens while giving other players heavy winds and C14 greens... conditions can easily dictate scoring opportunities.

    garyk49:
    Went back and looked, it had scored me as +3.

    this is another one of the problems and issues that need resolved.

    garyk49:
    The one big thing I did notice tho.  NOT VERY TALKATIVE.

    Mostly true... but depends on the person... in a showdown … I chat less because we only have 45 sec and I want to make sure I can think through my shot... every stroke matters more than regular coin games where you may just be killing time or familiarizing yourself with the game.

     

  • flatstick96
    188 Posts
    Mon, Dec 9 2019 11:40 AM

    Coins are comparatively worthless so I don't see the point in discussing them, but credits have real value, and are worth addressing.  that said...

    I don't necessarily disagree with what the OP is saying, but how is what he's describing any different from tierless ready-go or bracket tournaments? 

    WGT has always (as long as I've been around, anyway) facilitated formats where very, VERY good players can keep their credit balance up by preying on unsuspecting, inexperienced players in tierless tournaments.  The "rich" effectively "stealing" credits from the "poor" is basically a given in tierless tournaments to the point where it seems like a feature, not a bug.  Go play in a low stakes (10 or 25 credit) ready-go - the entire leaderboard is TL and up players with low 50's averages.  

    In that regard, showdown is exactly what should be expected from WGT.  The one area where showdown is better than those other formats is that the elite players can only enter the showdown once (or, at least, once per account).  So at least you don't see the same 5 people winning all of the different showdowns (like you do in ready-go's, for example).

  • kavvz
    2,195 Posts
    Mon, Dec 9 2019 11:58 AM

    Just a few observations.  I did play in the last showdown, and wasn't aware there were divisions.  Just clicked on it and selected play/tee off etc.  Thinking WGT should be in charge of assigning players to divisions.

    I had players disconnect on me, but it didn't impact my round in a negative way.  I was able to finish my 3 holes just fine.

    I did have one showdown where my opponent finished his/her round, ended up winning with their final putt and it didn't let me finish up.  I was just awarded a birdie.  Was that because my opponent scored a birdie or because I was within gimme range, not sure.  But I've missed some pretty easy looking putts on the desktop version for sure so in reality I was thinking, hey thanks!  Lol

    If occurs to me that coins may not be all that worthless in the future.  If they are how you upgrade your apparel well ...

    I played on the back tees where people I played against played whatever tier appropriate tees they were supposed to be on.

    I did kind of enjoy the format actually, something different and new.  Apparel, sponsors, head to head stuff.

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