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A Cure for Sandbagging?

• Dubfore 4,348 Posts

  Mon, Apr 24 2017 4:31 PM

  Has anyone suggested to WGT that instead of just relying on players scoring average (which we all know can be kept artifically high) as part of the calculations for moving up tiers, would it be better to have just a set number of games played in each tier (from legend upwards?) as the benchmark to move to the next tier?

  Could this put an end to members playing poor scoring rounds (sandbagging) just to keep their average high and remain at their tier level for longer, and be a step to a more level playing field for all who play in the Ready-Gos etc?

   

• alosso 21,032 Posts

  Mon, Apr 24 2017 9:30 PM

  So you worry about sandbagging Legends? I'd think that there are more in the lower tiers(?)

  Talking about numbers, Legends must play a minimum of 500 rounds to advance. Thus, after 500 really good scores in RGs, any Legend would probably be promoted. OTOH, there are Legends (like me) who will never contend in an RG and will never advance to TL on their own. Should they be pushed up after ?1,000? rounds without showing any capacity?

  BTW, I oppose to the following underlined assumption:

  Dubfore:

  instead of just relying on players scoring average (which we all know can be kept artifically high)

  I for one know better, as the average will only react to good scores after saturation - you can only keep it high by NOT playing any good scores (and NOT excelling in RGs).

  May I suggest that you try to improve your game if you want success in these?

• K7JBQ 1,468 Posts

  Mon, Apr 24 2017 9:49 PM

  I believe you have discovered a cure for which there is no known disease.

• DodgyPutter 4,690 Posts

  Tue, Apr 25 2017 12:20 AM

  alosso:

  So you worry about sandbagging Legends? I'd think that there are more in the lower tiers(?)

  I'd doubt it, the 500 rr's and the larger prizes available in brackets, rg's etc are key.

  There are lots of legends who are not sandbagging and that's why such a rule change would be unfair.

  alosso:

  Dubfore:

  instead of just relying on players scoring average (which we all know can be kept artifically high)

  I for one know better, as the average will only react to good scores after saturation - you can only keep it high by NOT playing any good scores (and NOT excelling in RGs).

  I think there are two groups that are called sandbaggers; some deliberately score high in rr's to keep their average high and win credits in mp games or similar and that is cheating.  There are others who get to Legend and play mp, ctth, par 3 and 5 rg's, maybe some of the high stake ranked rg's (all to the best of their ability); that, I would say, is not cheating.   There are however ways of scoring/playing well and lingering in Legend tier.

  Maybe an idea would be to include par 3 etc rounds in the 500, although they still couldn't count toward averages.  Perhaps even mp games could count toward that number in some way.  This wouldn't impact on players who simply weren't scoring well enough to be promoted but would see those "working the system" rise more quickly.

• Dubfore 4,348 Posts

  Tue, Apr 25 2017 2:56 AM

  I'm not an 'expert' about any of the stats (levels etc) here, and their's nothing in this game that worries me, not even those that take it way too seriously.

  I don't play or intend to play in RG's (atm), but would like to see fair play for any that do or those that would like to. Sandbaggers are not just a problem in RGs.

  Alosso, did you miss the question mark after (from legend upwards?)? It was a suggestion.

  Will someone link me to a post where positive suggestions have been made to tackle this problem. Or have WGT and the members conceded defeat on this?

   

   

   

• alosso 21,032 Posts

  Tue, Apr 25 2017 3:22 AM

  Dubfore:

  I'm not an 'expert' about any of the stats (levels etc) here,

  "As we all know" becomes a tad shaky by this confession ;)

  But I didn't answer your question at the top: I don't know such suggestion.

  My reply was meant to console you that things are o.k. now: No enduring success is possible in tiered L and TL tournaments without eventually advancing.

  But, IMNSHO, the fairness aspect visible in your proposal may be outside the company's considersations, with a high rate of certainty.

• Dubfore 4,348 Posts

  Tue, Apr 25 2017 4:01 AM

  Obviously, not everyone knows that sandbagging goes on, and knowing something about anything doesn't make anyone an expert on that subject. 

  I'll go look in the forums about sandbagging.

   

   

   

• alosso 21,032 Posts

  Tue, Apr 25 2017 5:07 AM

  Pure populism may help to win elections but not factual arguments ;)

  I'm afraid that you did not bring any proof about sandbagging or about the motivation for it in connection with premium tournaments. You also failed to discuss any of my arguments. No reasonable objections by you, so I am right?

  What's your point? To get outta here behind a curtain of bla-bla smoke?

  I'm well aware of multi-accounters who partly work their way up to roam in the Legend tier, but that's another subject.

• Dubfore 4,348 Posts

  Tue, Apr 25 2017 5:24 AM

  I didn't post this to score petty argumentative points (or any points for that matter). 

   I'm looking elsewhere about sandbagging (what I should have done in the first place instead of starting this thread).  No further comment from me here.

• 9,041 Posts

  Tue, Apr 25 2017 6:18 AM

  Dubfore:

  I didn't post this to score petty argumentative points

  You posted the exact thing in another thread..

  Should've left it where it was....Buried.

  This is a non issue.

  Andy