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50 Punch Advice

Tue, Jul 31 2018 3:16 AM (54 replies)
  • WaLk0fLiFe
    285 Posts
    Mon, Sep 4 2017 5:18 AM

    That seems like a lot of work to shoot rounds of 62+ . I am not mocking or degrading your game but holy cow...That is intense for such lackluster results :( Whatever floats your boat tho. I have never seen a post that made me experience every human emotion all at once, congrats on achieving that. GL!

  • Robert1893
    7,664 Posts
    Mon, Sep 4 2017 5:57 AM

    WaLk0fLiFe:

    That seems like a lot of work to shoot rounds of 62+ . I am not mocking or degrading your game but holy cow...That is intense for such lackluster results

    +1

     

  • wtiger22
    1,027 Posts
    Tue, Sep 12 2017 10:59 AM

    goldeena:

    OK, just to reserve a little space for later, all will be revealed between 2 different ways of going about the same thing.

     

    Just quickly:

     

    The result that we get here tells you how far the ball will travel out of a specific rough for a specific input shot power (which I will from now on convert in to distances), so say you hit the ball out of 30-40% rough with 90% power - or with 45yards on the shot bar - these tables will tell you how far the ball will go for that. You scroll down the tables to find the required power you need for the distance at-hand.

     

    My predictor on the other hand will tell you directly the input power you will need to go the distance you specified in the user control panel for the rough you also specified in the user control panel - it does the scrolling down the table bit for you.

     

    These 2 subtly different metrics can be inter-converted between one another, and I do this myself to compare models.....

    Screwed up earlier, let me do this inter-conversion thing again - hey I only did this late last night before bed, nobody is purrrfect, lols:

     

    From the illustration below you will see that I have taken the measured data for Punch 30/40% rough and derived an equation for it - a linear line of best fit, this enables me to create a model which can be assimilated in to my existing predictor.

     

    Now as it stands in the following equation (red arrow in the illustration):

     

    y = 1.27x -19.11

     

    The distance out for a shot power in (the way it is done here with the tables), makes 'y' the subject, so:

     

    y = (1.27 * 35) -19.11

     

    this brings about the 25 yard figure you will see from the tables if you look-up 70% shot power (35 yards).

     

    With my way of doing it (i.e. given a desired input distance tell me what I need to hit), I make 'x' the subject, so:

     

    35 = (1.27 * x )- 19.11

     

    This brings about the 42.6 yards figure in the bottom table (circled in green, rounded to 43), this figure then has to go through the selector (circled in black) to satisfy certain rough and distance limits if it is to be compared to my prediction for the same shot.

     

    So 42.6 yards input power corresponds to 85% in the table and that ties in with the desired figure of 35yards, everything comes around full circle.

     

    So to convert between the different methods we just change the subject (which I am sure most in here now wish I would change the subject, lols), between 'x' or 'y'.

     

    But thats not where the differences end....

     

    In my approach I split the rough compensation and the club compensation in to separate parts, this means I have to take my rough compensation figure from my rough table and then add an additional club compensation factor which is referenced from another table. The club compensations were derived by punching on the fairway of hole number 10 pinehurst.

     

    Club compensations are intrinsic to these look-up tables as the author took the shots out of actual rough using the actual club - he does it all in one, but there are advantages as you will see later in splitting these 2 aspects (rough and club compensation) up.

     

    So my method says to go 35 yards out of 35% rough add 5yards (bottom table circled in green), then reference the club compensation table for 35+5 = 40 yards and add this in too.

     

    Lo-and-behold the club compensation factor for a shot of 40 yards = 3.5yards, so the total figure I get is 35 + 5 + 3.5 = 43.5 yards, here you can see that part of my club compensation table:

     

     

    You can see this in the illustration as 43.8yds which would corrospond to 87.5% in the tables making me slightly higher at about 36.5 yards.

     

    This is already very close an outcome between the 2 models and I can tweak my rough factor so the 2 are identical, but thats not the point here because my predictor is tailored to my ball.

     

    The point is that both predictions yield results that are in the same ballpark when compared like-for-like, my predictor validates his data and his data validates my club compensation factors.

     

    they go hand-in-hand which is a nice ending :-)

     

    The thing to say was that by splitting the rough and club compen. in to 2 stages it means I can use club compen. generically for any rough - I don't have to go on course and shoot balls every time - the linear relationships of all 3 tables of tabulated data means the roughs can be represented by a single scaling factor at each % range and this is what I do, like many of you.

     

    if I want sand - I guess the scaling factor then bolt on the club compensation factor, same goes with fescue e.t.c.....then refine the guess in game, again like we all do.

     

    Thx,

     

    deena.

     

    Additional:

     

    I also bolted on my wind predictor to this assimilated method so I can have both figures pop up for full in-game parameters, sometimes there will be no figure at all - this in most instances will mean that the shot requirements are out of range, e.g: If I decide to take on a 40 yard punch in 25% rough with spin there will be no corresponding figure  because the guy who compiles these tables went no further than 35 yards for full backspin in that rough % - the selector sorts out all that and will return a null result if parameters are exceeded.

     

    Additional additional:

     

    Of course there is no need to find myself having exceeded shot parameters so easily - because I have the formula for the relationship between shot input power and yardage I can simple extend this to cover the full range of the club and this is the point about taking data and turning it in to a model - it's not JUST to be a clever dick, it's also because we can then take just a very small handful of on-course measurements and convert them in to an accurate prediction of what happens over the whole range of values. I am using this method in order to provide an additional club compensation for every single iron in my bag.

     

    Roddy are you back?

  • DonCaron
    5,502 Posts
    Wed, Sep 13 2017 3:54 AM

    thesupernova:

    goldeena:

    (circled in green, rounded to 43), this figure then has to go through the selector (circled in black) to satisfy certain rough and distance limits if it is to be compared to my prediction for the same shot.

    Oh my

    You are way overthinking your approach.to the game.

    And quit frankly trying to show off.

    Yes I majored in  mathematics ,you are not talking over my head.

    But this is long winded nonsense to be frank.

    If you really want to help people ,condense your information.

    An old philosophy........

    K.I.S.S.

    Keep It Simple Stupid.

    I use much simpler methods 

    All of which I can do mentally 

    No magic bullets

    No graphs

    No aerodynamic  formulas .

    Sometimes one can overthink this game.

    THAT will drive you to insanity.

    Hey 

    Everyone enjoy their weekend!

    xxoXO Allie

     

    Absolutely Correct. My problem in this game is that I think to much and over analyze putts, instead of just hitting it firmly in . 

  • joemt825
    124 Posts
    Wed, Sep 13 2017 8:38 PM

    This is the most ridiculous thing I ever saw.  It would take this person a month to complete one round.  Must be a joke. 

  • jefftow
    447 Posts
    Thu, Sep 21 2017 4:52 AM

    I'll stick with yours, it's simple and works 

    thanks for sharing your info

  • manxoli
    1,518 Posts
    Sat, Feb 3 2018 11:39 AM

    +1 Jeff no bs  just works.

    oli

  • MainzMan
    9,586 Posts
    Tue, Feb 6 2018 3:13 AM

    I have a Post-It note with a bunch of short lines about 5mm apart along one edge.  Under each line is a number.  I drew the lines on first, went to St. Andrews #10 in practice mode, played to just off the green and hit a bunch of shots using mulligans. The distance the ball went, including roll out, was written under the appropriate line.  I used half back spin on every shot and do the same during a round, slight variations for elevation notwithstanding.

    It took me about 5 minutes to make, adds zero time to how long it takes to play a shot and works very well.

    Job done.

  • MainzMan
    9,586 Posts
    Tue, Feb 6 2018 3:30 AM

    WaLk0fLiFe:

    That seems like a lot of work to shoot rounds of 62+ .

    I think it actually goes beyond that a bit.  For me posts like that, with such complex and unnecessary formulas are potentially going to drive new players away from the game.

    Let's say someone signs up, they aren't a multi so they are having trouble playing well. They come to these forums looking for advice.

    And read that........... How can I put this politely?

    Utter nonsense.

    Think "Bugger that for a game of marbles, way too complex for me" and go back to watching Russians crash their cars spectacularly on YouTube.  Perhaps never to return to WGT.

     

    This ludicrous calculation system, much like the real life La Ferrari, is for posing.  Look at me, aren't I great?  No, you're not.  A good driver in a Golf GTI will urinate all over some poser in his Ferrari in real life.  Just the same as a good player here will trounce someone using that deliberately long winded and confusing spread sheet.

  • TopShelf2010
    10,880 Posts
    Tue, Feb 6 2018 3:39 AM

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