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Re: Multi-player Green Speed

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Sun, Jul 25 2010 11:05 AM (8 replies)
  • WoodFairy
    33 Posts
    Thu, Jul 22 2010 11:39 AM

    I was going to call this post ' Screw you, Master!' just so you get an understanding of where this may  lead. Currently in multi-player mode the green speed is dictated by the highest tiered golfer.. i.e. Pro's fast,  Masters - Very fast etc.

    However, this system is unfair, especially for non masters who have to keep re-adjusting shots depending on their fellow golfers tier. Oh the masters have it so easy, same speed every time, yet they are a fickle bunch. The game takes too long to load .. they leave. They make a bogey at the first hole ... they leave. They find a bunker at the second hole ... they leave.

    The upshot of this is that the rest of us, all  pro's for example, end up playing with greens designated for masters, while the masters' EGO (for want  of a better word) has told them to  quit and run away to save face. God forbid they  have a worse round than a pro or even worse an amateur on THEIR green conditions.

    What is even funnier, you  will like this.. or may be you  wont, is that I have said to masters after I  have made a misjudgement with a putt, that 'it  is taking me time to re-adjust to the difference in green speed'. Get this, one cheeky  blighter said ' You should try the slow greens they are horrendous'. As you can imagine I was gob smacked, well actually  I literally  wet myself with  laughter, a Master ... someone who has 'Mastered' a particular skill or talent saying that. Yeah, right ... well mastered, yet foxed by  a slow green... so funny. 

    Before I go on, I will add that this is a generalisation. I know many masters are not like that, so no need to jump to any defence, after all I  didn't go with my original title.There are a number of pro's who do just that too (  but really they are shadow masters, they want  to be masters but they just  have not got it .. yet ).

    The upshot though is that the master was not wrong, changes in green conditions can have an impact on ones game. Its not the masters fault that he struggles on slow greens when he is used to very  fast ones, it's just that he has forgotten what they are like, as unless he enters a tournament he may  never have to experience a slow green again.

    There is an argument for fixing the green speed to whoever started the game it is. So if an amateur starts it  is at his pace, i.e. slow.

    However, you may be surprised to hear, I am not in favour of that. I would like it  more random. Much more random. After all a course will change from day to  day as the weather changes. Let the speed change between rounds so it  can be  fast or slow or very fast. Oh, what heck! Lets mix it  up even more, so that fast one time is slightly faster or slower than a fast the next.  Lets mix it  up,make it  more real.

    Then when someone who has reached the tier of master really  has achieved something ... and they can truly  call themselves as such and hold their head up high and wear  their medals and trophies with  pride.

    I know what  some of you  are thinking, well surely that will just  mean that those quitting masters will quit  even more in search of their favoured green speed. Perhaps it  will. But  you can factor that into the tiers, you don't  just  rely on an average, you have to play a percentage of rounds at different  speed too. It  wont  stop the ego-centric golfer quitting  but it  will make it  more fun  for those that remain as we are now used to differing  conditions, we may  not  have mastered them as yet, but give it  time.  At least it  stops us from being complacent, which must  be a good thing.

    It's time for change... you  know you  want  it : )

  • neildiamond11790
    1,115 Posts
    Thu, Jul 22 2010 1:48 PM

    dude, slow greens suck.  Just like many pro's in real life will complain about slow greens.  they are tough because you need to smack the ball so much harder that anymishit make you lose the line that much easier.  Slow in no way means easier in golf.  The only thing it does for amateurs is not allow them to blast putts by the hole, they will miss but it will stay close for a tap in.  I would take tournament speed greens anyday over SLOW greens.  I think most masters would as well.  At least on fast greens you get the line right, you often make the putt.

    As for the rest of your post, those people will always exist and it makes very little sense for masters to protect their average since there is no going back to pro.  But at least those players aren't gaining anything of value from it.  They are not sandbagging to keep out of master, they are not sandbagging to trick people in match play challenges.  So in my opinion they are the lesser of the 2 evils.  Worse to me are the "Master" level Pro's, who can shoot 62 without batting an eye, but throw in some 75's to keep their average at a nice cozy 68. 

  • marioh
    1,055 Posts
    Thu, Jul 22 2010 2:18 PM

    I've been complaining about this (green speed defaulting to the highest tier player) issue forever it seems.

    WGT apparently doesn't care.

    But on the plus side for you, I rarely will join a MP game with any player below Master, unless the host is a Master tier player (or if I'm invited to the game by the lower tier player).   I figure if another tier player joined a Master hosted MP game, they know what they're getting into with the green speed.

    Cheers.

  • YankeeJim
    25,827 Posts
    Thu, Jul 22 2010 2:42 PM

    Some players don't realize the Op's point about the default green speeds. I find it helpful to mention the VF green speed when playing with non-Masters. Sometimes it turns into a teaching moment.

  • hbthree
    478 Posts
    Sat, Jul 24 2010 6:56 AM

    What I find interesting is the fact that CC tourney rounds are played as ranked rounds and yet you have the capacity to set wind speeds, green conditions, and pin placements....wonder why same is not made available for ranked ( or for that matter "scored" rounds) outside the CC tourneys....hmmmmmmm...HB3

  • pauls
    1,146 Posts
    Sun, Jul 25 2010 1:47 AM

    iagree the green speed should be set to the lowest ranked player in the game, why should some one who is just learning to play the game have to play on very fast greens when they havent even learned how to putt on slow greens, makes it very hard on someone new to the game i reckon, whereas a "master" should be able to play under any conditions,   (even though slow greens are the pits and i hate them :)   )

  • wizbang360
    411 Posts
    Sun, Jul 25 2010 8:18 AM

     Personally   I think the green speed and wind should be set by the creator of the multi player round, they should be in control of the conditions of the round They start. The pin  positions should be random, when there are more then one on the particular course chosen. Then  those joining the round would have the option to join based on all things rather then just the course.

  • drewsterinone
    190 Posts
    Sun, Jul 25 2010 9:05 AM

    wizbang360:

     Personally   I think the green speed and wind should be set by the creator of the multi player round, they should be in control of the conditions of the round They start. The pin  positions should be random, when there are more then one on the particular course chosen. Then  those joining the round would have the option to join based on all things rather then just the course.

     

     

     

    i like the thought, but i cant change my hometown course wind speed and green stimper!!!  Well the stimper i guess i could if i talked to the greens manager, maybe he might do it.

    But I like the idea, and it can happen in practice mode, already.

    Maybe some day.

    DREW

  • wizbang360
    411 Posts
    Sun, Jul 25 2010 11:05 AM

    of  course    in real life the conditions are what the conditions are. But as we all know this is not RL   if they offer condition controls   I will use them  if not  I will play whatever they are.

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